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Installng new Focal 3 way component speakers...

This is a discussion on Installng new Focal 3 way component speakers... within the Mustang GT350 Electronics forums, part of the Mustang GT350 Garage category; Thank you Sir, much appreciated!! Originally Posted by hobbie1 Just sent you a message.......

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Thread: Installng new Focal 3 way component speakers...

  1. #21
    Senior Member HotLap's Avatar
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    Thank you Sir, much appreciated!!

    Quote Originally Posted by hobbie1 View Post
    Just sent you a message....
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    Senior Member racer172's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotLap View Post
    you might want to check out the threads over in the 6g forum.
    I'm not familiar with that forum, but I do want to dig into this because I agree with you the stock sound is unacceptable
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  3. #23
    Senior Member racer172's Avatar
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    @HotLap and @hobbie1
    First of all I just wanted to mention that I'm not try to bring down your installs here, but rather trying to see if I can do the same with good results.
    So I went back to my installer and told him you guys are replacing speakers with good results and asked him to read this thread and determine if he could do something similar.
    His email reply is below. Does this sound like what you guys have done or is there an element missing here?
    Most of this stereo-tech talk is over my head so that's why I'm asking for clarification.

    here's his reply:
    "It appears that no one in the thread that you sent to me has actually replaced the front speakers. The person that is looking into upgrading the front speakers with the 3 way Focal speakers does have the correct wiring info. The tweeter and the midrange are on one channel and the midwoofer towards the bottom of the door is on one channel. The crossovers for the Focal 165AS3 are not bi-amp capable so this will not work right with the factory outputs unless modifications were made. They all addressed the upgrade of the rear speakers. In our opinion, if any upgrade is performed, the front speakers should be the focus and not the rear.

    One the posts said that he replaced the rear speakers with the Focal 165AC. This will provide you some improvement in the upper frequencies but very little in bass or volume. The factory speakers are designed with smaller magnets and motor structures to make them super-efficient and so they can operate with a minimum amount of power. The Focal speakers are designed for a upgraded audio system with new amplifiers that provide more power than what is available from the factory amplifier. So to sum it up, upgrading just the front and rear speakers will provide some improvement but not a huge improvement. A audio processor and a amplifier are necessary to extract the full potential of the upgrades.

    The other post suggest replacing the rear speakers with JL Audio 6.5” woofers and adding an amplifier to power them. I’m not really sure what they are trying to accomplish but the car should have a factory subwoofer in the right rear corner of the trunk if he has the same stereo system as yours. The 6.5” woofers along with the amplifier will make an improvement if the car is not equipped with a factory sub."
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  5. #24
    Senior Member HellOnWheels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by racer172 View Post
    @HotLap and @hobbie1
    First of all I just wanted to mention that I'm not try to bring down your installs here, but rather trying to see if I can do the same with good results.
    So I went back to my installer and told him you guys are replacing speakers with good results and asked him to read this thread and determine if he could do something similar.
    His email reply is below. Does this sound like what you guys have done or is there an element missing here?
    Most of this stereo-tech talk is over my head so that's why I'm asking for clarification.

    here's his reply:
    "It appears that no one in the thread that you sent to me has actually replaced the front speakers. The person that is looking into upgrading the front speakers with the 3 way Focal speakers does have the correct wiring info. The tweeter and the midrange are on one channel and the midwoofer towards the bottom of the door is on one channel. The crossovers for the Focal 165AS3 are not bi-amp capable so this will not work right with the factory outputs unless modifications were made. They all addressed the upgrade of the rear speakers. In our opinion, if any upgrade is performed, the front speakers should be the focus and not the rear.

    One the posts said that he replaced the rear speakers with the Focal 165AC. This will provide you some improvement in the upper frequencies but very little in bass or volume. The factory speakers are designed with smaller magnets and motor structures to make them super-efficient and so they can operate with a minimum amount of power. The Focal speakers are designed for a upgraded audio system with new amplifiers that provide more power than what is available from the factory amplifier. So to sum it up, upgrading just the front and rear speakers will provide some improvement but not a huge improvement. A audio processor and a amplifier are necessary to extract the full potential of the upgrades.

    The other post suggest replacing the rear speakers with JL Audio 6.5” woofers and adding an amplifier to power them. I’m not really sure what they are trying to accomplish but the car should have a factory subwoofer in the right rear corner of the trunk if he has the same stereo system as yours. The 6.5” woofers along with the amplifier will make an improvement if the car is not equipped with a factory sub."
    Not an audio geek. I know some but hired a pro to install. We worked together to achieve the type of sound I was going for without a complete overhaul. I had to add the sub. I haven't seen one of these cars yet that actually have the sub already installed. I hear there are some out there. Just never seen one. My sub box was built to the specs of Ford's box, it's JL audio.

    My FoCal's were installed in place of existing speakers. I have 2 JL audio amps to power each. They are installed in the wheel well. Dynamated. Three way crossover with hi-lo line converter. I didn't want to have to mess with the head unit. I am getting excellent center stage with left and right side powering to center.

    The center factory speaker does not function while I'm listening to music. Only kicks in with stereo during nav and phone calls. Using the limited functions provided by the factory head unit I am able to get faders to work fairly well for front and rear stage. I will 99% say that this is a huge difference. Not 100% as I lack a bit of mid range and I do find the FoCal a tiny bit tinny in the high end. Still totally worth it for my taste. This was all done waaaay under 8k. Very reasonable.

    In case I wasn't clear, I should add the center speaker I am referring to is Ford's factory dash speaker.
    racer172 and HotLap like this.
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  6. #25
    Lex
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    For those of you that did add the sub, where did you get the input sound from to feed the amplifier?

    Because of the active noise cancelling and potential enhanced exhaust sound, I would think that tapping say the rear factory speakers would yield two problems:

    1) the sub is not tuned by ford to adequately cancel the exhaust drone and could induce undesirable frequencies
    2) you are getting a modified signal that may be blocking low frequencies the rear speakers are unable to hit

    This of course assumes that the rear speakers are serving the purpose to cancel unwanted drone frequencies. I am sure there are additional concerns, but getting a clean signal is probably the most important.
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  7. #26
    Senior Member hobbie1's Avatar
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    Read my posts as I think they will be helpful.

    The 2 rear deck speakers were replaced with 2 custom subs, some mounting hardware and 1 JL Audio MX500/1 amp and a whole lot of work on my part.

    The feed for the amp comes from the 2 leads to the original rear speakers.

    This kit is sold by Auto Fanatic, he has a channel on YouTube and also owns a 17 GT 350. His kit does wonders and sounds awesome.

    You should send him a note and perhaps he can answer your questions.

    I have driven the car all around town and on the freeway and have no issues, no drone sounds.

    Keep in mind the GT 350 Shaker does not have a sub in the trunk. It is a 9 speaker system.

    As i mentioned the car will be at the Mustang show on June 9th - Bill Brandt Ford Brentwood CA.

    Your welcome to come by and hear the setup.
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  8. #27
    Senior Member hobbie1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by racer172 View Post
    @HotLap and @hobbie1
    First of all I just wanted to mention that I'm not try to bring down your installs here, but rather trying to see if I can do the same with good results.
    So I went back to my installer and told him you guys are replacing speakers with good results and asked him to read this thread and determine if he could do something similar.
    His email reply is below. Does this sound like what you guys have done or is there an element missing here?
    Most of this stereo-tech talk is over my head so that's why I'm asking for clarification.

    here's his reply:
    "It appears that no one in the thread that you sent to me has actually replaced the front speakers. The person that is looking into upgrading the front speakers with the 3 way Focal speakers does have the correct wiring info. The tweeter and the midrange are on one channel and the midwoofer towards the bottom of the door is on one channel. The crossovers for the Focal 165AS3 are not bi-amp capable so this will not work right with the factory outputs unless modifications were made. They all addressed the upgrade of the rear speakers. In our opinion, if any upgrade is performed, the front speakers should be the focus and not the rear.

    One the posts said that he replaced the rear speakers with the Focal 165AC. This will provide you some improvement in the upper frequencies but very little in bass or volume. The factory speakers are designed with smaller magnets and motor structures to make them super-efficient and so they can operate with a minimum amount of power. The Focal speakers are designed for a upgraded audio system with new amplifiers that provide more power than what is available from the factory amplifier. So to sum it up, upgrading just the front and rear speakers will provide some improvement but not a huge improvement. A audio processor and a amplifier are necessary to extract the full potential of the upgrades.

    The other post suggest replacing the rear speakers with JL Audio 6.5” woofers and adding an amplifier to power them. I’m not really sure what they are trying to accomplish but the car should have a factory subwoofer in the right rear corner of the trunk if he has the same stereo system as yours. The 6.5” woofers along with the amplifier will make an improvement if the car is not equipped with a factory sub."
    In my case I have the 9 speaker Shaker part of the convience package - no sub in the trunk and as far as I know GT 350's do not have a sub in the trunk.

    Email Auto Fanatic on YouTube he will fill you in on his kit. He also owns a 17 GT 350.
    2017 Shelby GT 350
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  9. #28
    Senior Member HotLap's Avatar
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    Racer172, no worries, we are all on the same page here and just trying to understand/improve the dismal stock system. I too am no audio expert, so all input is welcome and appreciated!! Couple of things, from what I have researched, we don't really have the Shaker system, as we don't have the trunk sub. Many are puzzled as to why Ford even put the name Shaker in the Center stack? Anyways, there are several informative posts over on 6g where folks with the 9 speaker system have added subs w/amp, and processor to (if I understand correctly) regain the unaltered head unit signals. Seriously, I appreciate all of your input and we will figure this out!!

    Below is one example where a guy with the 9 speaker system (no sub) updated his system:

    "So I just installed a Kenwood Excelon 5 Channel Amp, two 6.5 Alpine door subs, both 6.5 Alpine rear deck speakers, and added a 12" JL Sub. Here's how and where I made the connections/wires using the factory Head Unit. I have the Mustang GT Premium with the 9 speaker set up.
    No factory sub.

    I got all my front speaker wires from the driver's side kick panel.
    It's the harness in the amplifier. You can easily find the speaker wires because they're twisted together. BE CAREFUL PULLING OFF THE KICK PANEL! It will break the tabs if you aren't gentle.

    To remove the hood lever, you have to take a flat head screwdriver and pop off the cover on the handle, then push the tab that sticks out inside the hole on the lever and it'll come right off easy. Once you see it you'll know.

    Colors are:
    LF
    WH + WH/BR - 6.5" door sub
    GN/BU + GY/BU - 3.5" Door Mid
    GN/BU + GY/BU - A PILLAR TWEETER (these are tapped off the 3.5"")

    RF
    WH/VT + WH-OG - 6.5" DOOR SUB
    VT/GY + YE/OG - 3.5 DOOR MID
    VT/GY + YE/GY - A PILLAR TWEETER (again tied to 3.5" in door)

    THE MIDDLE SPEAKER IN THE DASH IS
    GN + GY/YE -

    The REAR speakers are easy to get in the drivers kick panel, but I got mine from the rear deck. I just cut the stock speaker clips off, ditched the factory speakers and wired them up to the factory speaker wires.
    The colors for the rear are the same in the drivers kick or in the rear deck lid.

    REAR SPEAKERS:
    LR
    WH/GR + BN/YE -

    RR
    BN/WH + BN/BU -

    to hook up to my amp I used Line Output Converters AFTER the amp.
    and ran RCA's to the amp input. I cut the factory speaker wires in half at the factory amp harness clip in the driver's side kick panel.
    The side of the wire going to the amp harness clip I wired to the line output converter, then I took the other side of the factory wire and connected it to speaker wire and ran it to my amp. This seemed to me the best way to get the job done since you can't safely/easily run speaker wire through the door because of the plastic clips.

    There's a great ground bolt right behind the driver's side kick panel plastic. It's on the retainer where the kick panel clips in.
    9mm bolt I believe.

    Then I ran the 12v from the battery across to the driver's side and used the empty grommet on the far right side if you're facing the hood. It's easy access through the fire wall. then I ran the power wire down the center console. That is a pain. I had to remove the entire center console which is really difficult. If I did it again I'd run the 12v+ wire down the passenger side with the Remote Amp Turn on Wire.
    Try to keep power wires on one side of the car and speaker/RCA wires down the other to stop noise. I have zero noise through my system the way I did it.

    If You MUST run it down the center console .... here's how to take it out... 2015 Mustang center console removal - The Mustang Source - Ford Mustang Forums

    be careful of the plug you disconnect under the cup holders, the black one in the ky FOB detector, while it's disconnected the car won't see a key so don't think it broke when it says "no key detected" just plug it back in and you're fine.

    Now remote turn on wire... everybody's having trouble find them, but I found a little miracle wire by complete and utter accident:

    Forget tapping into the fuses. In the 2015 they're always on 12v+ plus, it's not a great install move. Could get pulled out easy. You should not add a switch, you will forget one day and you're battery will be dead from the amp being on.

    So, if you remove the passenger side kick panel there is a harness at the very bottom with a big fat green wire. It's staring at you at the bottom of the kick panel. Maybe 8-10 gauge. Just test it. It's perfect ignition on 12v+, accessory on 12v+, and off 0v when you turn the car off.

    To ground the amp, there's these cool little rubber grommets in the trunk on the floor under the carpet by the spare tire well closest to the rear seats. if you ground right by the grommet you won't hit anything underneath the car. (like a gas tank... be careful.)

    Then for the sub, I tapped a Line Output Converter right off the rear factory speaker wires and hid the LOC in the upper trunk lid and velcro'd it down. You'll see when you're in there. there's tones of open channels. For that LOC ground I pulled the driver's side rear side panels right off and found a beautiful factory ground right next to the driver's side seatbelt assembly close to the door opening. Some people say you shouldn't tap off the rear speakers, because of the Ford factory sound shaping cutting the bass... but you can. It works fine and it has plenty of Bass. It get TONS of bass to my sub. way more than any normal person would want. YES, rattles the whole car, enough bass. If it's not enough adjust the gain on the LOC and the sub level on your amp.

    I think that's it... It sound awesome and it works perfect.
    I had such a nightmare searching every inch of the internet to do this install because there's no info on the 2015 models yet that I had to share. I hope this helps anybody else trying to do it on their 2015 mustang. Go for it!

    It's not the "RIGHT" way or the "WRONG" way, It's just how I did it and it worked for me."
    Last edited by HotLap; 05-16-2018 at 08:31 AM.
    2017 GT350 / Lightning Blue / Electronics Pkg...

  10. #29
    Senior Member HotLap's Avatar
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    Racer172, forgot to add your installer is absolutely correct, just replacing speakers will yield very little improvement. I did replace with the Focals and not much better sound (if anything the better speakers just highlight the inadequacies of the stock system). My audio upgrade is a "work in progress" and I have been sidetracked on other stuff since this post a ways back. Have been mostly listening to that wonderful exhaust note, however, did a 300 mile road trip recently and in 6th going to need the sounds

    Going to check out Auto Fanatic's solution and a couple of others over on Mustang6g and jump into it soon - more to come!!
    Last edited by HotLap; 05-16-2018 at 08:29 AM.
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    Senior Member racer172's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotLap View Post
    Racer172, forgot to add your installer is absolutely correct, just replacing speakers will yield very little improvement. I did replace with the Focals and not much better sound (if anything the better speakers just highlight the inadequacies of the stock system).
    This is a really interesting thread, and complicated.
    My installer said that just replacing the speakers with more powerful speakers would create distortion at the higher volume levels, I asked why? and this was his reply:

    "The new speakers are designed to handle more power and they are not as efficient as the factory speakers. The minimal amount of power available from the factory amplifier will not provide enough the power to the new speakers and you will experience more distortion at higher volume levels (because there is not enough power from the amplifier to control the movement of the heavier speaker cone)."

    That explained it so even I could understand, LOL.
    HotLap likes this.
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